A MARTÍNEZ, HOST:
University students have been some of the loudest voices criticizing the Biden administration for continuing to supply weapons to Israel for its military offensive in Gaza. Many younger, more progressive voters had soured on Biden over his Gaza policy, but has that changed now that he's out of the race and the matchup is now between Democratic candidate Vice President Kamala Harris and her GOP opponent, Donald Trump?
Evgeny Stolyarov is a junior at Northwestern University and a member of Jewish Voice for Peace Action, a student group that helped organize protests on campus last year against the war. He also took part in protests last week outside the Democratic National Convention in Chicago. So I want to start off with asking you, what message do you think it sent that the DNC did not allow a Palestinian speaker?
EVGENY STOLYAROV: I think the message is very clear that despite Harris saying that she supports a cease-fire, despite her saying that she's all for Palestinian self-determination, in terms of actual actions, the DNC and the Harris campaign are not actually doing anything to ensure that there is a cease-fire and to ensure that Palestinians can experience self-determination.
MARTÍNEZ: Would a Harris presidency, a possible Harris presidency - would that change the situation in Gaza, you think?
STOLYAROV: Well, I think it's about the next couple of months and what Harris says on the campaign trail and what she commits to. Right now, there is clearly hundreds of thousands of people who supports an arms embargo on Israel. And if Harris stands up and says that she believes and sides with the American people on this incredibly popular issue, then I think the Harris presidency can be different from the Biden presidency.
MARTÍNEZ: Because she's still technically a member of the Biden administration, so she - I don't know if she can necessarily do anything as much as she has to be part of that administration, but a presidency could be different.
STOLYAROV: Yeah. I think it's about making guarantees. And I think not having a Palestinian American speaker at the DNC - when she says that we can't look away from Palestinian suffering, and then she looks away from Palestinian suffering - sends messages about what her behavior will be like as president. So it's understandable that as a member of the Biden cabinet, she is limited in what she can do. But even on the smaller things so far, she's been unable to show anything to American voters that she'll be truly different.
MARTÍNEZ: So let's hear a little bit from Kamala Harris' remarks at last week's DNC.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED RECORDING)
VICE PRESIDENT KAMALA HARRIS: Now is the time to get a hostage deal and a cease-fire deal done.
(CHEERING)
HARRIS: And let me be clear. And let me be clear. I will always stand up for Israel's right to defend itself.
MARTÍNEZ: Evgeny, she also called for self-determination for Palestinians. Is that - been enough so far to distinguish herself even a little bit from some of President Biden's rhetoric?
STOLYAROV: Well, it was more forceful than anything we've heard from President Biden. But I think for the hundreds of thousands of people who hear this rhetoric and then see her actual actions and see the fact that so far there is no changes as, you know, she's still the Vice President right now and on the campaign trail, as well, I think there is still a lot of doubt that even though she might say all these things, that that actually won't mean that she'll change the U.S. foreign policy and she will actually enact the thing that we need right now, which is an arms embargo.
MARTÍNEZ: What specifically does the Jewish Voice for Peace Action want to hear from either Harris or Trump before considering an endorsement?
STOLYAROV: Yeah. I think we clearly want to see people care about Palestinian lives, and that starts with calling for an arms embargo on Israel. This is something that is incredibly popular not just with Americans, but when it comes to, let's say, a conditional arms embargo, a majority of American Jews support that. So I think the first step towards securing any endorsements or any votes is about making sure that when you say you believe in Palestinian self-determination, you actually show with your actions that you want to see that Palestinian self-determination happen.
MARTÍNEZ: Now, during the spring, we've seen large protests on college campuses across the country. Fall classes at Northwestern University - that's your school - start next month. Do you expect similar protests in case there won't be a cease-fire by then?
STOLYAROV: Yeah. I mean, what we've seen throughout the summer is the university engage in more and more punitive measures, anything from arrests all the way to using various other disciplinary actions. And what that has done is only further mobilize students who have been, time after time again, on the right side of history and who will continue fighting until we see divestment on genocide.
MARTÍNEZ: Evgeny Stolyarov is a member of Jewish Voice for Peace Action. Thank you very much.
STOLYAROV: Thank you so much. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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